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Title

CharacterBuildCalculator (CBC)

Author

Kamiryn

Submitted / Updated

05-19-2005 / 04-13-2013

Files

Name	Type	Size	Downloads
CBC28381.zipCBC28381.zip Submitted: 05-19-2005 / Last Updated: 04-13-2013	zip	2.2Mb	50560
CBC v.2.8381 (NWN 1.69)

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9.92
73 votes
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SCREENS

Class Selection and Level-up

Spell casting and bard song

Skill selection

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Comments (357):

1 2 3 4 5 6 .. 11 12 Next>

Posted by MrZork at 2013-04-12 01:14:55 Voted 10.00 on 02/09/12

Thank you for yet another improvement to the CBC. One *very* tiny thing is that it looks like the protection is not enabled for the Character sheet in version 2838.

Posted by Valtarien at 2013-04-01 12:58:52 Voted 10.00 on 04/01/13

Superb! Thank you so much for this!

Posted by HipMaestro at 2013-03-04 07:57:43 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

I just noticed that you implemented the size-related skill level adjust last month and have DL'd it. Thank you so much, Kamiryn! For those of us that use your spreadsheet a lot, it is incredible that, even after almost 7 years later, you are still maintaining your submission's quality. I wish all authors of the Vault had so much dedication to their legacy. We at the New ECB just luv ya'!
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by Kamiryn at 2013-02-03 03:15:34 Voted 9.75

Hello Wykked Wytch,

if you go to sheet 'Character' and select for example 'Fighter' in cell 'BJ3' (dropdown box) you should be able to select 'F' in cell 'B6' (there should be a dropdown box). If this does not work there's something wrong.

Which version of excel do you have?

Posted by Wykked Wytch at 2013-02-02 12:29:46

Hello, I found this spreadsheet and it looks incredible. Nice work! I have a bit of a technical question though. When I try to input the order of leveling, no dropdown menu appears, and when I input the class name manually (identical to what I put into the class section) it says that it is invalid. What do I do? (I do not have a lot of experience with Excel :x)

Posted by HipMaestro at 2012-11-20 06:00:56 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

There are a number of hard-coded values used in calculating results (like BAB, for instance). Size modifier is a racial constant and one that can only be modified by either changing the race (via polymorph) OR within the appearance.2da size category. The ability modifiers used in skill checks, however, are conditional, affected by such influences as flat-footedness and curses. In this respect, size modifiers are actually the most reliable values used in skill checks. Medium races serve as the baseline (per Bioware implementation anyway) where other races diverge (and probably the most common size used in character building in vanilla environments). Bottom line is: in order to establish a static skill level for any character, the size modifier MUST be included and the engine mystery removed.

"We" are character builders that are still actively designing and discussing the designing of toons for the latest content and on-line environments. (See my sig for link to the NEW ECB. I'm sure your expertise would be appreciated. ;))

The idiosyncrasies of the information presented on the character screen and the values actually used by the game engine have been adequately documented in discussions of that topic for the past 10 years. Character builders, content designers and scripters of today recognize this fact and therefore rely on combat debugging to determine the true values. AB, skills and saves (specifically, epic saves) are a few of the elements that are revealed by examining the combat log. The errors are readily noticed by testing.

As I mentioned, your CBC is reliable enough that the values calculated can be simply confirmed by testing... except for the integration of the size modifier, that is.
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by Kamiryn at 2012-11-18 05:45:54 Voted 9.75

HipMaestro,

I see your point but still I think these size modifier bonuses to skill checks should not be included in the CBC because they aren't skill modifiers but hard coded skill CHECK modifiers.

The AB/AC thing is slightly different because AB/AC gets used only in combat while skills can be used anywhere (in user scripts for example).

However I might make it an optional feature in the next version.

BTW, who is 'we'?, and something like 'is full of errors' isn't really helpfull ;).

Posted by HipMaestro at 2012-11-15 09:58:51 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

BTW, one more comment. The character sheet is full of errors so we builders NEVER EVER consider those numbers. We verify everything using combat debugging and establish the build statistics from the testing data. What your CBC does, is make the testing values essentially just confirmation rather than correcting errors. It is still a tremendous labor saver for us all... which is why I am canvassing to get the all the peripheral size elements integrated. I am lazy! *lol*
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by HipMaestro at 2012-11-15 09:49:55 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

Ooops. I meant skill "affinities" stack with size (^above), not skill "proficiencies" stack with size (Bioware uses different nomenclature for skills than for equipment.) Same dynamic, though.
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by HipMaestro at 2012-11-15 09:43:21 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

Kamiryn,

The +4 size modifier stacks with the proficiencies. It's not a feat that grants these bonuses, it's the way the game calculates opposing checks. Size ALWAYS applies in those checks. For example, a small creature with 10 DEX and 40 ranks in Hide versus a large creature with 10 WIS and 40 ranks in Spot would receive +4 to the Hide check and the large creature would receive -4 to the Spot check, making the net gain in the encounter +8 for the small creature (am intentionally ignoring the feat portion of the skill check calculation for the sake of clarity). The actual opposed check would be Hide, small (d20 + 40 + 4) vs. Spot, Large (d20 + 40 - 4). Naturally, the net advantage between 2 small creatures would cancel out (i.e. Hide +4 vs. Spot +4) but it still comes down to the size modifier being calculated into the skill check(s). In this instance, I am only interested in the net stealth and detection skills of the build because I believe the CBC makes the appropriate size adjustments for AB & AC. You can test it with debugging, if you like, but in a vanilla v1.69 installation, that is the way it works.
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by Kamiryn at 2012-11-12 13:45:33 Voted 9.75

Hello HipMaestro,

thanks for your comment. However I think there's nothing wrong with CBC. For halflings for example both Skill Afinity: Listen (+2 to Listen), Skill Afinity: Move Sliently (+2 to Move Silently) are included. Also included is the Small Creature feat (bonus to AB, AC) but the +4 bonus to hide checks is applied only 'when dealing with larger creatures' (that's what the feat description says). And because the bonus is not visible in the character sheet it's also not included in the CBC.

Posted by HipMaestro at 2012-11-07 08:22:26 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

Apparently, the calculator is ignoring the size modifier for skills, specifically, hide, move silently, listen, and spot. For halfling & gnome the current calculation for modified level should be increased by +4. At this writing, I am making the adjustment manually prior to releasing a build. I am currently using v2.833, intended to update to the latest version until I noticed it has not been addressed in the latest versions. In any case, thanks for maintaining it so well, Kamiryn! ;)
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by OldTimeRadio at 2012-11-05 13:35:44 Voted 10.00 on 11/05/12

Very nice!

Posted by Kamiryn at 2012-07-02 08:19:39 Voted 9.75

Spells per day calculation for wizards with schools of specialization finally fixed.

Posted by Saduj at 2012-03-30 01:24:41 Voted 10.00 on 03/30/12

So handy :)
_________________________
Carcerian/Saduj's Submissions: (169 Portrait/Soundset Unlocker) (12 NWN Fonts) (30 NWN Fonts) (Auto-Emotes) (Custom Dragon Disciples) (Dynamic Wildshape) (Keyring) (NPC Schedules) (Sacred Shields) (Spawning Undead) (Shayans Subrace Engine for 169)

Posted by Kamiryn at 2012-03-01 21:58:33 Voted 9.75

Thanks for reporting the bug, I'll take a look at the weekend.

Posted by MrZork at 2012-02-09 21:58:15 Voted 10.00 on 02/09/12

Oops. I meant to say the spells/day calculation was off at level 5 for specialist wizards, not at level 4. The cells to be changed to fix the calculation error were correct.

Posted by MrZork at 2012-02-09 21:54:07 Voted 10.00 on 02/09/12

The CBC is awesome! An excellent tool for planning builds, with the added "interactive learning" benefit that one will learn tons about character building by using it.

One slight bug (?), though. The spells per day calculation for wizards with schools of specialization are off at level 4, due to three cells on the SpellsClassLevel sheet. Cells BU9, BV9, and BW9 on that sheet should have values one higher than they do (that is, they should have values 4, 3, and 2, respectively).

Thank you so much for the CBC, Kamiryn.

Posted by Whitering at 2011-10-02 10:58:45 Voted 10.00 on 10/02/11

Just got back to NWN whilst waiting for Swotor, thanks a lot.

Posted by yatzik at 2011-08-09 03:34:58 Voted 10.00 on 08/09/11

Excellent job.
_________________________
Do dance with the rogues.

Posted by criss at 2011-04-25 17:36:38

rebueno
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: p

Posted by criss at 2011-04-25 17:35:46

XD JEJE BUENO

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: p

Posted by Kamiryn at 2011-03-21 11:08:52 Voted 9.75

Hello HipMaestro

>Diamond Soul and Diamond Body
Was fixed in 2.834.

>what did the HP fix (i.e. 2.836) entail?
HP calculation was wrong for CON 9 (and 7).

Posted by HipMaestro at 2011-03-20 19:13:27 Voted 10.00 on 03/04/13

Just checking on a point, Kamiryn...

On my version, monk's Diamond Soul and Diamond Body feats are flipped in sequence under the "Classes" feat column. This may have been corrected just after I downloaded in 2009 but never hurts to check, eh?

Also, what did the HP fix (i.e. 2.836) entail? not your actual work, but rather what was being calculated wrong? It always seems to work fine in my version.

In any case, what an irreplaceable time-saver and excellent format your CBC has become in my NWN gaming experience. It's great to see you still have your toes in the water. ;)
_________________________
The NEW Epic Character Builder's guild

Posted by redmokah at 2011-03-10 13:43:37 Voted 9.00 on 03/10/11

I forgot to add: it does seem a bit slow at times when doing certain calculations. I'm guessing this is a limitation of Excel however.

Also I noticed you had to assign the regular feats before you could assign the bonus feats. I thought that was a bit strange since it's non-chronological; not that it matters haha.

When creating my first NPC, I wasn't sure how many attribute points you normally got when you started. Quick research answered that, but I'm wondering if that's also shown somewhere on the sheet.

Finally, I'm wondering why the attribute modifiers aren't tallied into the calculation. What's the reasoning behind this?

Posted by redmokah at 2011-03-10 13:31:11 Voted 9.00 on 03/10/11

One of the most useful tools available to a Module creator. The auto-levelling wizard is terrible haha.

It might be difficult for someone who isn't technically proficient to navigate the sheet. That's the only reason I'm not granting it a full 10.

Personally, this is the most useful tool I've used in creating my custom module. Thanks for the obvious hard work.

Posted by Kamiryn at 2011-03-02 06:59:17 Voted 9.75

Hello ChrisTOTG,

while this would be a nice feature indeed it's not possible unfortunately. Well, perhaps it would be somehow possible to implement the feature but I'm very sure excel couldn't do the required calculations in a reasonable time.

There are 95 cells where you can select a feat (human bonus feat, 14 regular feats, 40+40 bonus feats). So at the moment the CBC runs 95 feat tests. With your suggestion not just the actually selected feat but all 590 feats would require a test. And that for all the 95 cells. So we would end up with 95*590=56050 feat tests. Far far far too many...

Posted by ChrisTOTG at 2011-02-28 16:31:50 Voted 10.00 on 02/28/11

Thanks for making this great tool! I've been using it for ages, and I'm quite pleased to see that you're still maintaining it.

I would really like to see the data validation moved forward one step - that is, is there a way that you could only allow feat/class options in the dropdown lists *if they are valid*?

I see it working like this: Put a choice on the data entry page to "Allow invalid feats"; when it's selected the data validation prevents "red" feats from appearing on the dropdown, and when deselected the behaviour is like it is now.

...I'm not sure if that's a clear request.

Posted by Kamiryn at 2011-02-07 06:48:22 Voted 9.75

@Halgroth:

Well spotted! That bug probably was there since version 1.0. Not many players plan their chars with CON 9 (or 7) I guess :D. Got fixed in version 2.826.

@GrannysPugFarm: Sorry, no. But perhaps you (or someone else) can try to expand the CBC to levels up to 60. I've no idea how difficult it would be but I think it has been done for the Higher Ground PW.

Posted by Halgroth at 2011-02-04 08:02:07

Fantastic tool! I've been using it for years now.

I recently noticed that negative constitution doesn't seem to affect hp. With a con of 9 (modifier -1) spreadsheet says I'm getting 10hp per fighter level, when in fact 10-1 = 9hp per level. No toughness.

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