I haven't noticed being hit without damage being a big problem in Knights. It probably occurs but the combat animations are so fluid that it's a reasonable trade-off. Indeed, it's also not so unrealistic to be hit without taking damage. A high AC can come from from purely armor, dodging and parrying. When an attack is deflected by nothing more than the character's armor, then the character appears to have been hit but takes no damage. This happen even when not wearing armor at all as I've practiced the martial arts for many years. Sometimes while sparring, you get hit, but it doesn't do a thing because the attack was weak, the distance was too close or far or it was purely glancing. Computer games are really much closer to cinema than to PNP games. It's a visual, cinematic experience. Things which work fine as a game mechanic in PNP, such as 6 or 7 attacks per round or turn based combat, work fine in PNP; however, when you see it brought to life in a computer game, it looks unrealistic. This is where a non-visual game and a visual, cinematic device will inevitably always collide. To accurately depict combat in a video game, it's necessary to adjust the rules to fit the visual medium. For example, as one becomes a more experienced fighter, you typically attack less than an inexperienced fighter, but you miss less and your attacks do more damage. This is pretty accurately handled in KotR2 actually. The animations don't show all of your attacks, but more damage is done as if you had attacked multiple times (thus satisfying the PNP game rules). For PNP roleplaying games to really be effectively adapted for video games, the rules have to change. People need to let go of the idea that video game rules should match the PNP. It doesn't work. It's true that at higher levels, the multiple attack animations don't look too bad, but it could still be improved a lot. The animations should do more than have the characters just stand there and chop really fast with their two-handed weapons or wave their single-handled weapons around really fast in front of themselves.
Yes, i've played through KotOR2 several times and i really enjoyed the fights/animations at the end on Malachor V, where my character sliced through hordes of dark jedi but the enemies who hit you (visually but not really) where always a source of amusement for me.
Fact is, the main characters in nwn2 could learn something from the KotOR2 heroes.
And the waiting is not so much apparent at higher levels, where you have a higher BAB, so you attack more often, the combat animations for a 16+ level monk with circle kick are completely fluid for example. (If circle kick would not strike already dead opponents :D)
Actually, KotR doesn't work like that. Only the charater you have targeted parries and locks blades with you. The enemies behind you take swipes at you freely. But the attack animations are also much more dramatic and more realistic looking really--the attacks have flourish and the character's entire body moves as he attacks as opposed to just standing there and swiping with his sword from time to time. Sorry, I just played KotR2 again recently and I was surprised that it didn't really look as dated as I expected compared to NWN2. In fact, I felt like some points such as the animations, the way the camera functioned, and the modeling of the heads were much better than NWN2. They've tried to add flourish to the attacks in NWN2 with the occasional jumping twirl attack, but it just isn't quite right--too sporadic and a bit ridiculous at the same time.
komuro, you have a point there. but this could only solve the problem with the main character, because i imagine it would be very funny, when half a dozen orcs surround you, and as they wait for their turn, they parry your - nonexistent - attacks...
Well, it might be a lot to ask, but in answer to Kolompy's question...how about clashing weapons, parrying, etc. like in Knights of the Old Republic. The combat animations in those (older) games (KotR2 also made by Obsidian) were much better than NWN. You never appeared to be waiting for your opponent to attack.
I don't know what the problem is with the combat animations. I mean what do you expect them to do while waiting for their turn? If they jump around doing something that does not make any sense, that would be even more awkward. And it would be confusing too, if a character chops like crazy with his greataxe but does no damage whatsoever because it wasn't his turn it was just the animations...
They look pretty enough, but could perhaps have more oomph in the sound department. I'm recalling NWN1's Wail of the Banshee, for example (which was just a lvl 9 wiz spell, not even an epic). And I'm not sure what some of the lighter colored ones were even doing, aside from the graphic..? _________________________ Aspiring author; NWN builder and DM.
"Sethal's Progeny: Wisdom of Wyrms" now on the Vault in closed beta! Link
I agree, it looks like old Battle Chest i used to play and even that had more battle animations. Hope the Toolset and GM Stuff are at least that good as promised.
Posted by Jamro at 2007-09-20 06:51:31 Voted 5.00 on 09/20/07
That I'll-just-stand-here-until-it's-my-turn is as painfully stupid looking as ever.
Wouldn't it be about time to have some combat animations in the game?
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