**This is the SOU version. There is an updated HOTU version with further bug fixes on the 'Mines of Moria Module Update' link** SOU and HOTU versions of my previous adaptation of the Lord of the Rings journey through Moria have the ability to select up to three henchmen per PC. You may choose Aragorn, Gimli, Legolas, Boromir, Gandalf, Samwise or even perhaps Arwen to help you in your quest, or might like to recreate these or other members of the fellowship as PCs yourselves. Other features include scripted oozes, a tentacle beast, turn-to-stone trolls, rock throwing stone giants, displacer beasts, ring wraiths, flying skulls, poltergeists, the Balrog and other demons, serpents, custom clothes and items, and other events that capture the spirit of the Mines of Moria and of Tolkien's world in general. There are also a number of new levels, cut scenes and many new conversations with characters from Tolkien's world.
Dear Rock' The henchmen were made by adapting 69MEH69 excellent system but I tried to change the AI to make them use weapons better and also to allow healing of bled ing henchmen. I looked at how the cut scenes were done in the Official campaign. You may find mine much easier to follow. Look at the OnEnter script for that area in the toolset of my module. It took months and months of my spare time, which is why I and other module creators get upset when someone comments "better than the Bioware official campaigns" and votes it for Hall of Fame, but their vote mysteriously changes to 3 out of 10. I think I just used Lisa's druid type staff and robe on a standard human appearance. Best of luck if you are about to embark on a module of your own! Start small and work up. Try the lexicon and some of the tutorials on the Vault for more tips on module creation. John
Posted by rockineddievh80 at 2004-06-2813:26:00
I have a few questions about how you made your module. How did you make your Henchmen. How did you make the video at the begining. How long did it take you to make this. How did you create Gandalf's appearence. Email me back when you get this. rockineddievh80@yahoo.com
Posted by rockineddievh80 at 2004-06-2813:26:00
I have a few questions about how you made your module. How did you make your Henchmen. How did you make the video at the begining. How long did it take you to make this. How did you create Gandalf's appearence. Email me back when you get this. rockineddievh80@yahoo.com
Posted by Larathiel at on05/22/04
"Finally, you draw comparisons between my module and the films. I can only take this as a compliment." Well, at least we can agree that futher between you and I is moot. I will not however go without first defending myself... Firstly, I (and my whole group) were in a very foul-tempered mood following the conclusion. At the time, I felt that my *comments* were VERY mild compared to how I *felt*. Looking back however, I can see why you would think I was trying to be a troll so I do apologize for that -- next time I'll wait 24-hours. If the old rating system were in place, you would have seen that my ratings might have been different (Fun: 4, Layout: 6, Dialogue: 5, Creativity: 8, Quality Control: 5), but unless I'm totally blind, the breakdown format is gone. Therefore, I now rate by overall satisfaction, i.e. fun. I think to do otherwise would be dishonest of me. Also, trying to villify me for giving your module a rating of "4" (which is 1 step below average, btw) is more extreme than anything I said. If I was out to ruin your module's rating then I'd have been rude and simply given it a "1". This may be "your module" but if you had created this only for yourself then it wouldn't be here on NWVault. I've given feedback on dozens of modules over the past year or so and I give praise and criticism equally. Just because you and others have a different opinion from *your* experience does not make my group's any less valid for *our* experience. Even when dissatisfied, I still give constructive notes on the particulars of what my group sees as right/wrong in case the authors are still releasing updates for their work. Overlooking or otherwise choosing not to see where constructive criticism is infered doesn't mean it's not there. BTW, to clarify on something, Arwen somehow died in the scene just before the orcs of Isengard. The dialog we received was as if we were speaking to her in Rivendell and it looked like Elrond should have replied next (but couldn't since he was not present). Since you think I'm trying to compare yours to the movies, I may as use an example from them to clarify something... Aragorn and Legolas clearly helped some of the less agile members of the fellowship to avoid falling to their dooms. It's reasonable to expect that characters in a party who are in a reasonably close formation would also use Aid Another to assist someone teetering on the brink of doom. Of course, there is no provision for that built into NWN, but given the creative scripting with the door and in other areas, it's conceivable that such a script might be within your capabilities. Also, please don't assume that everyone you rebuke is a D&D newbie. I've been DMing for 12 years now and have kept up with every rules revision since 2nd Edition including Player's Option, 3rd Edition, 3.5, Star Wars, d20 Modern and the alternate rules of Unearthed Arcana. Pages 145 and 146 of the 3.5 PHB wouldn't give rules on what happens if you don't just stabilize a character but actually heal them to or above 0 HP if it was impossible to increase the current HP of a downed character. Therefore, I'd say our dissatifaction with this facet of the game is very well-founded. With that said, I will concede that playing styles may differ, so perhaps then the problems we encountered would be non-issues for most others. Still, after the public fall-out and anger many Tolkien fans felt at Peter Jackson's movies, anyone basing a module on LotR *with storied characters* should expect in advance that a good portion of the entertainees will be offended by what are effectively change to that history. It happens in Star Wars books, with Pearl Harbor movies, with Biblical movies and with Tolkien fan-work so it's naive to expect that some people won't view your work in the same light. Lastly, you have decided to venture into the realm of trying to mock me based on my [forum] signature, when I issued no insults at your person. That cannot go without answer... Larathiel, my favorite D&D character, whom I have played both in PnP & CRPGs *for the last 9 years*, was given the title "Death Elf" by a clan of dwarves who lacked a good foundation in the Elvish language of that campaign world. "Death Elf" doesn't imply some dark, pseudo-gothic, vampire (half) or other undead cliche'. Instead it was their way of trying to put into words the impassionate DEATH she single-handedly visited upon an entire brigade of Drow who had overtaken their citadel. Not wanting to insult her new allies (she's definitely an ambassador of her people), Larathiel did not balk at the unusual title. It stuck with the other players in the party I was with (the SW reference, "That blast came from the Death Elf!" subsequently came up anytime she delivered an impressive attack) and I also grew to accept it over time. So yes, after having a 9-year character using that title for at least 6 of those years, I think I have the right to use it as I please.
Posted by karimus_cormaven at 2004-05-2423:59:00
HI, ***SPOILER**** I don't care what the "Death Elf" says; My family thoroughly enjoyed, "Mines...". 1. The trap portal that turned my char into a zombie was "HILARIOUS", we laughed for almost a half an hour while I walked the char back to the last location I found to rest. It was funnier than "all heck" :-) 2. When we found the BALROG, I have to give you credit for the most "EERIE" feeling I ever got from a game ! There was MUCH MORE HILARITY and FUN, "Keep doin what ya doin !" You have an insight ! ---woodelf
Posted by Author at 2004-05-2412:42:00
Dear ttopping (and others), **Spoiler** I have looked at the issue of this obelisk button because someone else reported a problem and I have just discovered a bug. If you find the button on the obelisk, a conversation starts asking if you wish to press it (and open the fallen altar). If you say no, you get another chance. But if you abort the conversation, perhaps by moving in the instant the conversation triggers so you did not even notice it, you have no second chance. I have just uploaded a correction (v1.5), where the conversation cannot be interrupted, and with an additional script on aborting which resets like saying no, but I appreciate this is no consolation to you, having become completely stuck as a result of this. Sorry. If you do not have a save game beforehand, you could save your character, go into the toolset and start the game again after changing the start point to the west edge of the next area, Khazad Dum vestibule I think. Thanks. John.
Posted by Author at 2004-05-2412:33:00
**Comments below directed only against previous poster, and is not relevant to the many kind people that have given constructive criticism** I totally reject your comments and the gall with which you pubiicise them. How dare you write to anyone like that - a complete stranger who has done nothing more than spend some spare time creating something that others may download for free. If you get so extreme about the trivial matter of a slightly negative experience with a free fan-created custom content related to a computer game, how do you deal with important things in life that don't go quite as you anticipate. To answer your top 10 heinous sins that the module commits: 10. Mis-typing - it was just a weak pun. Even if you thought it was a mistyping - it was a mistype in the walkthrough text, not even in the game!! 9. The door isn't picky. I designed it to open on charm or hold spells. That's just my choice for my game. I'm sorry you wanted every enchantment spell in the book to be able to "entrance" the door, The ones that work are charm person, charm monster, charm person or animal, hold person, hold monster. That should be enough, especially as the scrolls for these are obviously dropped in the same sack as where you received the clue for opening the door in the first place. 8. I'm sorry but the bioware scripts for henchman behaviour are difficult and difficult to correct. So sometimes the bowcasters will engage in melee. 7. Bleeding - again my module, my choice, and also D&D 3rd edition's choice. I spent ages creating scripts that allowed healing packs to stabilise bleeding negative hp characters, and allow recovery, to approximate 3rd edition rules, and you, or your "players", petulantly want to be healed instantly up to maximum. There's supposed to be a penalty for reaching negative hp, ie cheating death. If you don't like D&D rules, or NWN rules (not even bleeding), don't play it. 6. A bug that no-one else has reported and I have not encountered in dozens of trials at resurrecting her. I'm sorry but these one off blips do happen, both in official campaigns as well as custom modules. 5. Always is completely wrong. I set spawn points for nearly all encounters at a distance. Sometimes I might do it on top of PCs eg near a door, to suggest that they might have burst through. If there are one or two that you consider inappropriate, I could always change these pspecific examples, but no, you say "ALWAYS". In regard to stealth, you are villifying me for not completely revolutionising the Bioware encounter trigger system to take account of stealth not triggering encounters?! 4. Stone of Duergar - what kind of comment is that - a random expletive? If you don't think it is official LOTR, perhaps you should have read the intro paragraph that states the module is not a slavish recreation. Are you the stone of Duergar Thought Police, yet you can call yourself Mr. "the Death Elf" in public? 3. Likewise - its called a trick teleport. The effect is temporary but meant to startle. Ever played Ravenloft? - I have not even been completely original. 2. I have no idea what this is about, The Balrog does not "run about". There is no dead end corridor. There is a lair somewhere - clearly a wrong route. It is explained why the Balrog is unkillable in that particular scenario. Why should my story be that you should "knock them off" a bridge just because you say so? There is only one Balrog. 1. Again totally wrong. The trap is DC35 detect, reflex save DC 15 minus any dex bonus to avoid the first time and DC 25 if the same PC insists on going back over the same spot again. Re "no-one else could help her", do you seriously think that someone falling off into a bottomless abyss, is going to be in a position to be helped? What would you have thought if in the book or the film Frodo fell off the stair, and then Aragorn went down thousands of feet to pick him up and dust him off? Re "Being told that Gandalf killed the Balrog" bears no relation to my game. If the ring is with the party, and Gandalf is not already in the party, he runs to join you, tells you to run over the bridge and then you witness his combat with the Balrog culminating in the both falling off the bridge. If you never bothered to look back and just left him to it, that's your problem. Finally, you draw comparisons between my module and the films. I can only take this as a compliment. But you again forget that the film was to make money - my little custom module was a free fan download, and as such does not merit lambasting by you or anyone else. The only criticism one can draw against fan content is the failure for the uploader to bother to make updates when real bugs (not your's) are pointed out, and I have always had enough respect for the NWN community to do this where possible. You may think you have succeeded in bringing the module's rating from the top ten, where it has been for several months, down into the 100's in a single day, but you have already failed because, with the publicity gained by its high position for so long, anyone who may have derived some enjoyment from the adventure has probably already had the opportunity to try it out, and that is all I ever wanted. I will not be entering into further correspondence with you.
Posted by Larathiel at on05/22/04
My group and I found this to be quite the frustrating module and one that takes even more liberties than Peter Jackson with a bottle of whisky in one hand and an upside down copy of the Two Towers in the other. Top 10 complaints by my players: *** SPOILERS *** 10: Readme Joy: It's "mellon" not "lemmon". 9: Casting enchantment spells on doors that are picky about what enchantment school spells you use. 8: Henchmen who don't know what "avoid melee and only use ranged attacks" means (Legolas). 7: A bleeding script that doesn't allow you to heal someone while they have negative HP (you can only stabilize them and they die immediate upon recovering if say... in an area containing an unopenable door and a tentacle monster). 6: Henchmen that you resurrect and whose "let's team up again" script is busted (Arwen). 5: Stealth? What's that? Enemies spawn in by script regardless of how quiet you are and ALWAYS right on top of you so ranged attacks are nigh useless. 4: Stone of Duergar? WTF? 3: Teleporters that turn you into Zombies. 2: Unkillable Balrogs who run everywhere really fast and appear in dead end corridors where there should be a bridge to knock them off of. and the #1 complaint.. 1: Playing this God-forsaken module for 6 hours only to have the ring-bearer get killed in an unavoidable trap on the Dark Stairs where she got NO saving throw and no one else in the party could help her. That's just dandy. Being TOLD that Gandalf killed the Balrog (even though he wasn't in the party) without seeing anything was also classic but by that point most of us had quit playing because of the game-ending design ingenuity on the Dark Stairs. --Larathiel the Death Elf
Posted by Larathiel at on05/22/04
My group and I found this to be quite the frustrating module and one that takes even more liberties than Peter Jackson with a bottle of whisky in one hand and an upside down copy of the Two Towers in the other. Top 10 complains: 10: Readme Joy: It's "mellon" not "lemmon". 9: Casting enchantment spells on doors that are picky about what enchantment school spells you use. 8: Henchmen who don't know what "avoid melee and only use ranged attacks" means. 7: A bleeding script that doesn't allow you to heal someone while they have negative HP (you can only stabilize them and they die immediate upon recovering if say... in an area containing an unopenable door and a tentacle monster). 6: Henchmen that you resurrect and whose "let's team up again" script is busted (Arwen). 5: Stealth? What's that? Enemies spawn in by script regardless of how quiet you are and ALWAYS right on top of you so ranged attacks are nigh useless. 4: Stone of Duergar? WTF? 3: Teleporters that turn you into Zombies. 2: Unkillable Balrogs who run everywhere really fast and appear in dead end corridors where there should be a bridge to knock them off of. and the #1 complaint.. 1: Playing this God-forsaken module for 6 hours only to have the ring-bearer get killed in an unavoidable trap on the Dark Stairs where she got NO saving throw and no one else in the party could help her. That's just dandy. Being TOLD that Gandalf killed the Balrog (even though he wasn't in the party) without seeing anything was also quite lame but by that point most of us had quit playing because of the stupidity on the Dark Stairs. My advice to others is to play something else or get ready for lots of endlessly spawning enemies and pointless mazes.
Site
