This is the updated version of CC1. The update includes extra areas and missions, a new hak that is the same for CC3, and all the extra goodness that comes with the two expansions. The main henchperson has been expanded on also. v1.1
Posted by colourwolf at 2008-09-05 21:31:43 Voted 5.00 on 09/05/08
Unplayable due to extremely poor grammar and spelling.
Posted by Jamro at 2008-08-15 16:02:56 Voted 8.50 on 08/15/08
So I got halfway through before hitting a game breaking feature.
Venom Flesh, she was sneaksy and stayed in her nymph form while I easily killed her. Can't continue from there now.
All through the module, the lack of polish is obvious. There are lots of "insert text here" markers, there was an earlier encounter where easily killable plot critical NPC nearly broke the whole thing down.
The areas are too large and too full of repetitive encounters for my taste. And there's lots of backtracking through those large areas as well.
I picked this up for the "roleplay heavy" aspect, to find this roleplay light.
This is a hack'n slash through and through.
The areas are well constructed though, extremely good looking.
The plot is interesting indeed, I'd have loved to see it through.
With a thorough once over, this could be one of the very best modules in it's category,
now it's a good one, with potential to cause annoyance and upset if (like me),
the player breaks up some plot critical script.
Seriously, you just cant put an enemy out there attacking me,
who's killable with one stroke, but killing whom breaks the module!
Posted by DrFraud at 2008-08-06 18:14:36 Voted 7.50 on 08/06/08
The dialogue was quite good, with plenty of evil-ish choices. Combat was mostly well-balanced, with only a couple of sticky spots for my barbarian. The lack of any healing potions stronger than Cure Moderate Wounds was a major annoyance, however, and many of the map pins from the trip to the Elven Court onwards said "Place text here" rather than any more helpful labels.
I enjoyed these modules very much and am eagerly awaiting the 3rd installment. Any ideas when that will be? I realize the creator is busy, but, patience, especially for a cleric/rogue of Tymora, just isn't in the job description. _________________________ Well...who would have thought THAT would happen?
Posted by SusanMcKinney at 2008-01-24 08:45:13 Voted 10.00 on 01/24/08
I really, really enjoyed the storyline. I liked the entire adventure. I am getting ready to play ccg2 and hope to find it as well done as this adventure.
Posted by WeAreAllKosh at 2007-11-14 18:42:18 Voted 5.00 on 11/14/07
And just to answer a comment by Kymechu last year, about the lore inconsistencies.
The world in this module is not Gygax's world or Cook's world or Tweet's world, granted. But it's not Abaddon's world either. It's Ed Greenwood's world. The module is set in the Forgotten Realms. Nowhere does the author indicate otherwise. If he wanted to make changes to the cosmology, he could have used his own custom-made world or explained that he was using an altered Forgotten Realms. He did not do so.
But let's face it ... that wasn't his intent. These were errors, plain and simple. You're going to tell me he changed Manes from a type of Demon to a type of Devil because that was part of some unique vision of his gameworld? That's quite a stretch. Bottom line -- he wasn't familiar with the lore and didn't bother to research it. Calling people out for holding this against the module on the basis that they 'missed one of the central concepts of the PnP game' is quite feeble.
Another tired old weapon of the custom content apologist -- 'you only voted low because you don't understand.' When that one is used, it's a pretty clear sign that something in the module is poorly presented.
Posted by WeAreAllKosh at 2007-11-14 11:36:12 Voted 5.00 on 11/14/07
I wonder what Themerson knocked .25 off for? Heh.
How to handle this module? Well, the fact that I got through it without wanting to propel my head through a wall of masonry attests to the fact that it isn't a total disaster. It has a -fairly- cohesive main plot (when that plot remains on track). NPC's are at least comprehensible when they speak. There are little bits and pieces of creativity, like the custom creatures (bizarre as some of them may be) and the 'original Vampires' and the White Samurai. It's decently goal-oriented, and the goals are engaging enough that I stuck with it through to the bitter end. Basically, I was given reasons to care about the main plot. It isn't horrible.
But it isn't great either. It's fair, so I give it the absolute middle vote. There are four overarching things that bothered me a lot about it.
First, the game breakers in the area and plot layout. When I first left the crossroads with my mission to hunt the Sahaguin (we'll get to them), I noticed there were two other areas I could travel -- the Elven Court and the Wyrmwood. I figured those areas were optional, so I took the Wyrmwood path first. An unfortunate decision. It turns out that the Sahaguin plot would have taken me to the Wyrmwood and, further, that certain scripts acknowleding my completion of that plot would have fired when I reached that point. When I approached those scripts from the other direction, without completing the Sahaguin plot, the scripts fired anyway. My henchman made a comment about surviving an encounter with a green dragon ... as I was approaching the cave in which the dragon laired, -not- as I was leaving it when the comments were supposed to be made. When I spoke with the dragon, mentions were made by my PC and the dragon of collapsing tunnels and dying Sahaguin, things I was totally in the dark about because none of it had actually happened yet. When that conversation ended, I received a journal entry telling me that the Sahaguin were taken care of and I should report my success to Abaddon. The plot was broken and I had to reload a save. I never even tried to Myth Drannor path. The question, obviously, is why am I allowed to enter those areas if they are vital to later aspects of the plot? You can't enter the area with the Lich until the near-end of the module, so the author obviously knew how to restrict certain areas at certain times. Why aren't the Court and Wyrmwood areas restricted? So that I feel like I'm playing a nonlinear game? Well, when the game breaks, it's not nonlinear -- it's disjointed. That's all provided that this wasn't just clumsiness by the author.
Clumsiness is a big theme with this module. Half the map tokens just saying 'Place Text Here' for instance. But that's small potatoes. The dialogue structure is the worst example. The dialogue trees are all put together very poorly. Options frequently come up before they're supposed to (you can say to the Crossroads merchant 'I've been told you sell a few items' before Abaddon actually tells you this). Many options are offered which all lead to the same response, even if the response doesn't line up with the option ('I'm not so sure I want to do this' 'I'm glad to hear that enthusiasm!'). NPC's often give you their introductory dialogue even after you've spoken to them already ... this is a particularly annoying problem when certain options abruptly end the dialogues, and it often allows quest rewards to be received multiple times. Conversation with NPC's just isn't a picnic in this module. There are custom creatures and items in the module, but if you examine them they still have the descriptions of the creatures and items they were copied from -- Abishai have the gargoyle description, the Hell Warriors have the Helmed Horror description, etc.. It doesn't take that much effort to punch in a custom description for these items, or at least erase the description already there. Did the author overlook this aspect or did he just not bother? It comes across looking incredibly bad. Focus often strays aimlessly from the main plot. The Cania quests were the worst example of this. I'm trying to escape Hell to get the Soulstone back to Abaddon ... when some Vampires ask me to hunt down a succubus queen that's been plaguing them ... and when I'm hunting her down a monk intercepts me and asks me to go hunt down the White Samurai. So I have a quest embedded in a quest embedded in a quest -- three layers of distraction that don't really tie into each other or allow me to deal with them on my own time (I've got to complete the quests before I leave Cania). I like having things to do, but those two quests are poorly timed. And when I return to the Vampire Lord with news of the Succubus' death, her death is not recognized in his dialogue; we just go through the same 'did you take care of her' 'I'm still working on it' spiel. The author has mentioned that niggling errors inevitably find their way into a module ... but that's a pretty major error and I find it hard to believe that a simple playtest couldn't unearth it. These are just bigger examples. Through and through, this is not a professionally assembled module.
I don't get bothered about spelling and grammar errors as long as I can understand the author's intent. That applies here. But I do get bothered when a creature's name is repeatedly and consistently mispelled. 'Suhuanguin' is about the worst butchering of 'Sahaguin' I've ever seen. Admittedly, it's not an easy one to spell. Nor is 'Abishai' (spelled 'Ebishai' in this module). But it would it have been too much bother for the author to just look the names up? Refer to D&D books if he has them? Or at least do some Googling to find the proper spelling? It hurts the module even more that he frequently gets his D&D and Realms lore wrong. Sahaguin are not reptile-kind; they're fish-kind. The module frequently refers to them as reptilians and even gives the player weapons with bonuses against reptilians. For someone with even a casual knowledge of the lore, this is a frequently jarring misconception on the author's part. There are also the Devil-Demon mixups with the Manes and Succubi -- both Demons in D&D lore, but represented here as Devils. Of course, the Hell-Abyss confusion is often tricky, such that the 4e designers as actually taking additional steps to separate them; heck, even the OC designers screwed this up with their 'Belial, Demon Lord of Fire' nonsense. But again, a little bit of homework on the author's part was all that was needed to making the module look a little less haphazard (in other words, less like the OC). And I'm not really sure what the author thinks a barghest is. I'll overlook the fact that they're stomping around Hell rather than Gehenna. But for some reason they're big hulking bipeds (using the Grey Render model). Barghests are shapeshifting wolf-goblin hybrids -- one of those two models, possibly with a script to shapeshift between them, would have been more appropriate.
Finally, there's the combat. By the time I reached the last area of Hell, I was involuntarily gagging anytime I encountered an Ebishai (sic). With the exception of a couple of refreshing 'boss fights' you fight the same creatures over and over again in monstrous groups. And it doesn't matter what the creature is. It could be a group of mooky Dire Rats, a group of Gnoll Devil Shamans with their color spray spells, or a group of Imps that are able to whittle a PC down surprisingly fast with magic missiles -- you're going to encounter the same number. And ... yep ... they respawn. So after you've cleaned up your 27th group of Ebishai, you turn around and realize that a new group has respawned right where you cleaned up the 26th. There's no control whatsoever over encounter design. It seems like the author just randomly placed the creatures he was using, and placed them in large groups to be on the safe side.
All told, a good deal of total effort was given because of the sheer size of the module ... but it just seems likes the author was only giving half of his effort at any given time. So half of the maximum vote possible seems appropriate.
But this is the Vault, where 9's and 10's are in vogue ... so YMMV.
Posted by Themerson at 2007-10-28 18:26:46 Voted 9.75 on 10/28/07
Very entertaining and challenging. I thought the balance was good.
Posted by dwong1207 at 2007-05-11 13:46:16 Voted 8.75 on 05/11/07
Like I said in my earlier comments, this a great and creative module. The story is interesting and the use of the different tilesets was great. There are some spelling errors and unfinished joural entries and several "missions" I completed by didn't get any exp. for, and as annoying as it kinda was, it didn't take too much away from the overall game. Good job!
SPOILERS
I took a beating when trying to get to Venom flesh and thought there should have been some journal objective about that. The Vampire Lord didn't even acknowledge anything I did.
Posted by haraets at 2007-05-11 12:10:30 Voted 10.00 on 05/11/07
loved the first 2 parts, looking eagerly forward to cc3 (when??)
Posted by dwong1207 at 2007-05-08 11:21:07 Voted 8.75 on 05/11/07
Enjoying the module so far, about 2-3 hours in at the magic school. I'm working through with a Ranger 6/Wizard 2/Arcane Archer 2. Having the fireball arrows has made a big difference. There are some spelling errors, but it doesn't bug too much. Overall, a good module with good adventure. I normally like to know the whole plot line, but the suspense is good is revealed as the game progresses. Good job! Will cc3 ever come out?!?!
Seems to be a good module so far but I seem to be stuck right now...
*spoilers*
I am in the elven city, and have freed the planetar and found the soul gem. However, I have been unable to find any sort of scourge devil, or any devil that drops a head so that I can destroy the gem. Any suggestions as to where to look?
Thanks!
Posted by Razide0506 at 2007-01-28 08:13:53 Voted 5.00 on 01/28/07
I played for a good couple of hours before giving up. The module is full of flaws: grammar and spelling errors, stilted dialogue, missing waypoint descriptions, no music in some areas (and this doesn't appear to be an aesthetic choice), and at least one spot where the same message keeps popping up whenever you pass over a trigger (this should have only happened once). I didn't even get to the plot-killing stuff other folks have mentioned. My biggest beef, though, is that the challenges are very unbalanced. The game started relatively easy for my lvl 7 paladin, but once I got to the undercaves the difficulty ratched way up, which even then wouldn't have been so bad except that I couldn't buy anything better than a cure moderate wounds potion (and there were few of any other kind available either). I don't understand why this module has rated so highly.
Posted by Scrotok at 2007-01-20 21:46:33 Voted 9.50 on 01/20/07
Awesome mod!
*SPOILER* Jumping the party leader (without their knowledge or consent) into the gnome's room was the most humorous thing I've seen in NWN in a long time. As I recall, the party leader (male fighter) was so shocked and enraged at having been stripped and jumped into the gnome's room that he attacked and killed the gnome -- only to discover that the door was locked (DM intervention required, once we stopped laughing).
Lots of innovative scripting, new monsters/tilesets, etc. Great job!
Posted by Steve_Savicki at 2006-12-19 07:32:17 Voted 10.00 on 12/19/06
Ack, coding. Meant Many area transitions marked simply
< Insert Text Here > _________________________ Steve's Characters - please don't forget to vote on them if you play them.
Thanks,
Steve
Posted by Steve_Savicki at 2006-12-19 07:27:05 Voted 10.00 on 12/19/06
I would normally vote lower, but I presume these are not a problem in the original CC1:
1. Many location transitions marked with ""
2. Character scripting not accurate - you can kill the gnome prositute and he respawns downstairs.
He also doesn't drop a key if you kill him, leaving you trapped inside the door.
3. Minor bugs.
I hope Andrew fixes these. _________________________ Steve's Characters - please don't forget to vote on them if you play them.
kymechu: Abaddon hasn't posted in over two years, so your problems are probably not going to be addressed.
If anyone else out there has solutions, workarounds, etc., please post them. Thanks in advance.
Cheers,
Dave Fritz
Posted by Scrotok at 2006-11-25 20:00:00 Voted 9.50 on 01/20/07
***SPOILER WARNING***
There's a halfling/gnome in the Crossroads Inn who you can "make a deal with". However, when I made the deal, a different PC was "jumped" to the room upstairs. This PC was the first PC to join the server (the server/savegame host). This same bug happened later, when we interacted with the Nymph (after killing Venom succubus).
Posted by Scrotok at 2006-11-25 19:57:22 Voted 9.50 on 01/20/07
Awesome mod!
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-24 20:00:05 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
the revenant was far too powerful for me when i first entered the mage school ruins, and once i got strong enough, i was trapped offplane, and couldn't go back to finish it. so by the time i cleared it out, i'd already come back to Prime via Grimwald's portal, and when i came back after clearing the school, Grimmie still had the dialog about my arrival on Prime and his tip about the Lich. thus, the school quest was broken, and i can't get the incantation to use the portal.
enjoyable storyline, but you really need to do at least some basic testing.
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-24 18:33:20 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
figured out the Venom Flesh bit without aurora, won't go into details to avoid spoilers, but if you'r stuck on it, try exploring the immediate area around her. as for the communication globe, couldn't even find it in aurora, which was rather puzzling... is it just decoration? if so, might want to be a bit clearer, as it sure looks like a plot fixture, making for a lot of frustration for those of us who bother to pay attention to our surroundings, and decorations are irrelevant for the rest of the players anyway.
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-24 18:10:05 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
Found the "beautiful succubus", not sure if she's Venom Flesh, but if she is, i wonder why she's named "beautiful succubus" instead of "venom flesh". whichever she is, she didn't transform, drop something, ect, she just died. now i'v got some shimmering orb here, says its an arcane communit, but i can't seem to use it to communicate with anyone. back to aurora to find the screwup...
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-22 11:12:38 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
ok, found this chick darcy in the toolset, is that who i'm talking about to M? she's commoner faction, pathetically weak, not tagged plot, invincible, etc, and she's standing right next to encounter SuhYuan (second one by that name). she probably was executed by them the moment i set foot in the area. if you'r gonna leave someone for me to rescue, you need to account for some way for them to still be alive at least long enough to get anywhere near them, and unless you GUARANTEE their survival, you need an alternate discussion path for when they don't survive long enough to give advice.
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-22 01:25:34 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
i got to the second stone blockage in the tunnel (first being the one in M's grove, that he clears when you first meet him). i went back to talk to M, to see about him clearing it, but when i started to ask him to, the dialog option for it had me telling him about rescuing some chick, who then told me what i'm looking for is just past the cavein. who is this gal i'm supposed to have rescued from the scaleys? i'v not rescued any such woman, nor seen any sign of a woman to rescue, nor did i see any corpses that might be from her dying and thus screwing up that meeting.
Posted by Kymechu at 2006-11-21 11:55:53 Voted 8.25 on 11/24/06
clone_six seems to have missed one of the most central concepts of the PnP game. every rule is an optional rule. when you get together with a DM and several other players, its the DM's world, not Mr Cook's, Mr Tweet's, Mr Williams's, or even Mr Gygax's or Mr Arneson's (unless one of those fine gentlemen happens to *be* your DM, in which case, lucky, lucky you). yea, sure, the books describe devils and demons, and the cosmology you describe is refered to as the "core" one, but it doesn't have to be the only one. if you'r gonna talk about knowledgability regarding *planar* matters, you might want to be familiar with the Manual of the *Planes*, which describes several other cosmologies one can use in place of that one, including one with only a single evil outter plane, with all the demons and devils there working together against the various celestial types, who also have just one plane among them. its not that rare for someone to run a campaign without a Blood War. plus, while the Blood War is... surely by now you get the point.
Posted by Scroogius at 2006-11-18 12:42:53 Voted 10.00 on 11/18/06
I just ended the module, and it's really a great one!
Posted by Scroogius at 2006-11-05 12:52:41 Voted 10.00 on 11/18/06
Hi Abaddon, I found a little bug in this module.
When you meet Entarius the first time, on the ship, you can speak to the Captain before speaking with the lich, tell him that you "want to go down to rest" and you will skip the dialogue with Entarius and go directly to the next map.
Posted by Brainhaven at 2006-10-12 19:39:06 Voted 8.00 on 10/12/06
Love the mod, but just need to say that I'm having the same problem that many other players have reported - Venom Flesh does not do whatever it is that she's supposed to do. (Revert to some other form? Drop a plot-required item? Whatever it is, she doesn't do it.) Pretty frustrating.
Posted by icarus30 at 2006-08-19 07:48:26 Voted 9.00 on 08/19/06
It's been a while since I've played this one, but remember liking it a lot. There were a few spelling/grammar problems, but...Anyway, just about to start part 2. Thanks.
...but why at the beginning of the mod, if you start with a charachter setted to lev 1, the game doesn't take it to lev 5 or 10? If you start with alev 2 or plus instead the game gives to him 15 (15?!) levels...
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